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  1. #1

    Cpanel - time to dump it?

    This is not meant to be a troll, but as a customer of shared hosting for several years now, I've had it with cpanel.

    It seems all of the multi hour downtime I've experienced in the past years under cpanel providers has always been about cpanel updates gone awry. This has happened under 3 different cpanel providers. Now that it's also been a target of a mass hack makes me want to get a little more security through obscurity with a less ripe target. Also none of the providers I've been with ever seems to have too much positive to say about cpanel and they always seem to be dealing with some sort of glitches from them.

    Am I off base in these thoughts?

  2. #2
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    There's kind of a holy war that goes on around these boards about control panel software. I can't be sure about your downtime problems, but otherwise I wouldn't disagree with you.
    Corey Northcutt | Electric Goat Media
    Currently building this nifty small business ROI calculator.

  3. #3
    My experience with cPanel has been very good so far.
    Chris

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by ad572

    Am I off base in these thoughts?
    yes,

    As far as i know, biggest thing so far is this recent hostgator exploit.

    I think, mostly, when something does not work, people tend to blame cpanel.

  5. #5
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    ad572,

    You're certainly not too far off the rocker.
    I know I've been considering ditching it entirely since the recent exploits popping up.

    As a client you get the long end of the straw. As a provider we don't get much choice after we reach a certain # of clients (migrations are not pretty).

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by David
    ad572,

    You're certainly not too far off the rocker.
    I know I've been considering ditching it entirely since the recent exploits popping up.

    As a client you get the long end of the straw. As a provider we don't get much choice after we reach a certain # of clients (migrations are not pretty).
    Recent? Cpanel's been two steps behind on software updates for ages.
    Patron: I'd like my free lunch please.
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by hcn
    I think, mostly, when something does not work, people tend to blame cpanel.
    That's because, mostly, it's their fault. Unfortunately there's a rock and a hard place. Most customers prefer CPanel and even if they didn't, there's nothing better. You can say whatever you want about the other control panels but they all lack important "features." That may not mean much to a system admin that's head over heels for security, but it means a lot to the consumers.

    Rock and a hard place my friends.
    Michael Chase
    Clear-Data Internet Services - Inexpensive website, reseller, and game server hosting.

  8. #8
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    Smile

    Quote Originally Posted by cd-mchase
    You can say whatever you want about the other control panels but they all lack important "features."
    Like what?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by cd-mchase
    Most customers prefer CPanel and even if they didn't, there's nothing better. You can say whatever you want about the other control panels but they all lack important "features." That may not mean much to a system admin that's head over heels for security, but it means a lot to the consumers.

    Rock and a hard place my friends.

    I hope your customers are aware that you choose features above security. Its a shame.

  10. #10
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    First if your hosting providers have had major downtime due to cpanel updates recently then they are either lying or they are do not know what they are doing.

    The problem with cpanel used as it is today is that it makes it seem too easy to become a host and there are tons of host out their that have no idea what they are doing and expect their control panel to do it all and to provide all the security for their systems.

    When something happens to their server many of them blame cpanel when it reality it was their own stupidity that did it.

    I have seen host blame every thing under the sun on cpanel updates but what they fail to tell you is that in their own stupid rush to be the lastest and greatest they did updates to bleeding edge or choose to use untested and un proven module updates to their servers. Other times cpanel updates have broken things such as bind etc.. BUt why was it cpanel that broke it ? No the truth is your host chose to use perl updates from vendors so when the cpanel update ran and it did a system update as your host told them they wanted it to do it brought a faulty bind update that the vendor NOT cpanel put out.


    Now saying all that cpanel has it problems I will agree and the some the stupid exploits that has happened in the past like the last one are inexcusable and as Tim Geer pointed out this patch is only a band aid on the real problem this exploit uncovered. So I am not going to tell you to go with one over the other I will tell you though that ever major control panel vendor out there has had problems in the past and will have problems in the future. Cpanel's problems get pointed out here faster than most of those because they are the largest control panel in use. And believe me I have sat at my desk and cussed cpanel more than once as I ran fix it scripts on a 100 servers at 4am in the morning, but hey at least it is not Windows.



    But don't believe all the BS about downtime due to a bad cpanel updates, without finding out if every other cpanel host is also down because of them.
    Because most of the time it is your own host that shot himself in the foot.

  11. #11
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    Hi!
    I'm in the process of doing it...completely cpanel free...but just for my hosting.

    However...I think this is foolishness talking about dumping cpanel for hosting customers. I've been at this for a very long time...and I've seen 'em come and go. Remember the big H-Sphere push last year? Not too many of those folks still around..I've noticed...just the big boys (and quite possibly girls!)...and some of them were smart enough to realize they needed to offer cpanel as well in order to survive.

    Just thought I'd throw a little bit of reality in to all this. I fully understand many hosts are very frustrated with Cpanel right now...but...come on now...

    I just hope many hosts will band together *this* time and make sure Cpanel makes changes to the way they do things...it's been a long time in coming.

    Bryon
    Last edited by bryonhost1; 09-25-2006 at 04:47 AM.
    Bryon L Harvey
    Soil Relocation Engineer

  12. #12
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    ..and some of them were smart enough to realize they needed to offer cpanel as well in order to survive.
    Thats really not true.

    Yes if your trying to attract clients from forums like WHT then you will likely need Cpanel... but there are MASSIVE amounts of clients and markets needing hosting who wouldnt even know what cpanel, hsphere et al even are, or care!

    If you think you MUST use cpanel to survive, then your really short sighted as to where your looking to tap your clients from.

  13. #13
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    Hi!
    I'm not going to argue about this..I don't think much will be accomplished.

    The simple fact is exposure. If you have never had Cpanel...or any control panel...
    then you don't care. I've got to tell you...once you have had it...ummm...things change. I had my first cpanel account eons ago..circa '96-'97? It changed my expectations..totally..of what to expect from a host. Period. Forever.

    Just me two cents.

    Bryon
    Bryon L Harvey
    Soil Relocation Engineer

  14. #14
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    Customers love cPanel - Hosts and admins hate it.
    Thats been my experience and at the end of the day, ask yourself who pays for this gig, the answer is your customers.
    Web Hosting Plus
    Premium Australian Web Hosting

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by cd-mchase
    That's because, mostly, it's their fault. Unfortunately there's a rock and a hard place. Most customers prefer CPanel and even if they didn't, there's nothing better. You can say whatever you want about the other control panels but they all lack important "features." That may not mean much to a system admin that's head over heels for security, but it means a lot to the consumers.

    Rock and a hard place my friends.
    yep, it is what clients want.

    Myself I hate it, its gay and cluttered and totaly owns your server. I like directadmin but it hard to sell, plesk is mega crappy, and havent tried much else.

    another thing I hate on cpanel is making packages, adding customers, and then having to go back and add this or modify that.

    Id love to ditch it but it sells so what can ya do?
    There is still cpanel 0days out there I assure you.

  16. #16
    I got a friend of mine who decided to go his own way until he tried cPanel and now says that he has to use it!

    I've used DirectAdmin, cPanel and Plesk at different points of time and I still prefer cPanel for its ease of use. This is me as a customer.

    I haven't used anything other than cPanel as the admin so I can't comment about Plesk or DirectAdmin in that respect.
    Ajay D'Souza

    WebberZone

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by cd-mchase
    Most customers prefer CPanel and even if they didn't, there's nothing better. You can say whatever you want about the other control panels but they all lack important "features."
    Nothing better that's purely subjective. What "features" are in CPanel that other control panels don't have? Other than a customer requesting a "control panel" we have done quite well NOT offering cpanel by offering DirectAdmin instead. Customers want their site and control panel to "just work" and not have to constantly worry about security risks. The WHT crowd that seems to prefer cpanel, like other things on this forum, can quickly change their mind about how much they like cpanel.

    With customers security will become their #1 issue, if their Cpanel host is constantly being broken into regardless of what "features" they have available.

    Something tells me we will get a lot of converts from Cpanel to DA in the near future.
    Larry Ludwig
    Empowering Media
    HostCube - Proactively Managed Xen based VPSes
    Empowering Media - The Dev Null Blog

  18. #18
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    I havent really had any problems with it, more or less like many of you have said above the problem isnt with the updates its that the people who own the servers have no idea what they are doing.
    DJ Anderson
    Need Hosting?
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by SSHocker
    Customers love cPanel - Hosts and admins hate it.
    Thats been my experience and at the end of the day, ask yourself who pays for this gig, the answer is your customers.
    At least I don't like cPanel and I try to stay away from hosts using cPanel.

    I prefer hosts with their own control panel.
    It usually means those hosts know how to program and more capable.

    Also, cPanel is heavy and slow.
    If users and hosts love cPanel, it means they don't care a lot about efficiency.
    With careless hosts(admins) and fellow users, you can expect resources to run out sooner and more problems.

    I also want to stay away from users/lovers of PHP for the same reason.
    But it's pretty difficult these days, unfortunately.

    One advantage of heavy and slow software such as Windows, cPanel, PHP and its apps
    is the hardware improvements.
    As they don't run well unless the machine is quite powerfull, people using
    efficient softwares get amazingly fast responses, and things tend to work
    even when other heavy softwares start to fail (due to high load).


    I estimate we can host at least five to ten times more users per server
    if everyone used better softwares. (No cPanel, no PHP, no monster Perl OOP code)
    Imagine the advantage of that in terms of profits.
    But we need replacement language(s) and apps for that.

    As for cPanel replacement, it's just a web interface for admin scripts,
    and a good programmer can make small and fast drop in replacement
    or something new with migration tools, quickly, IMO.

  20. #20
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    Please would you people stop responding with 'I haven't had any problems with it' while your boxes are open to root exploits. It shows just how naive you are.

    You won't have problems with the cPanel. It'll be the script kiddy with a 0day tip that you'll have problems with.

  21. #21
    I agree with extras, I would place far more trust in a hosting company that has developed it's own feature rich control panel than a third party service. This demonstrates the level of competance of the host.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by David
    Please would you people stop responding with 'I haven't had any problems with it' while your boxes are open to root exploits. It shows just how naive you are.

    You won't have problems with the cPanel. It'll be the script kiddy with a 0day tip that you'll have problems with.
    And you know that boxes are now open to root exploits now how?

    You know there is a 0 day attack coming how?

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by David
    Please would you people stop responding with 'I haven't had any problems with it' while your boxes are open to root exploits. It shows just how naive you are.

    You won't have problems with the cPanel. It'll be the script kiddy with a 0day tip that you'll have problems with.
    thank you

    I have had one issue with cPanel exploits in the past to gain root access to my web server. The server was as secured as could possibly be to our knowledge. The hacker even told us how he did it by using cPanel exploits.

    What pissed me off more is that it turned out to be a customer that I trusted, and they decided to format the server.

    That's another story, though.

    Either way, cPanel exploits are not fun. I learned that the hard way.

    Just because your server is secure, that doesnt mean it really is secure

    Matt
    Matthew Rosenblatt, and I do lots of things.
    Used to be a full time server administrator, now I help build cruise ships and inspect homes.
    My company, Ferrell Solutions, specializes in home inspections and property management.
    RecallScan is a service for monitoring appliances and vehicles in your home for recalls.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Techark
    First if your hosting providers have had major downtime due to cpanel updates recently then they are either lying or they are do not know what they are doing.
    Exactly.

    We've been using cPanel for years and only screwed up once...maybe about five years go when we first started with it. Why? Because we thought that allowing cPanel to auto-update was a good time-saving idea. We've since learned and have not had one cPanel update related outage since.

    --Tina
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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Techark
    And you know that boxes are now open to root exploits now how?

    You know there is a 0 day attack coming how?
    Er, well according to the slashdot thread where the bluehost CEO himself mentions several root exploits that they have available for cPanel only systems that have not yet been patched.

    I'm not going to spit hearsay though so I'll leave it be. Believe as you wish.

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